Minutes of a meeting held on 28th May, 2014.


Present:  Councillors K.J. Geary, H.C. Hamilton and Mrs. M.R. Wilkinson.


Also present:  Licensing Officer, Environmental Health Officer and South Wales Police.



(a)       Appointment of Chairman -


Councillor H.C. Hamilton was elected Chairman for the duration of the hearing.



(b)       Declarations of Interest -


No declarations were received.



(c)        Licensing Act 2003 - Application for a Premises Licence - The Office Bar and Club, 40 - 42 Windsor Road, Penarth -


The papers within the agenda for consideration at the meeting contained a copy of the procedure to be followed at the Licensing Sub-Committee hearing and those present were advised of this.


Also present: Mr. B. Warren (Applicant), Mr. T. Thomas (Witness for Applicant); Interested Parties - Mrs. M. Jenkins and Mr. D. Owen.


The Chairman, following introductions, welcomed those present to the meeting.


The Licensing Officer outlined the application and stated that on 1st April, 2014 an application was submitted by Mr. Bryn Warren and Mr. Qamar Arif for a Premises Licence under the Licensing Act 2003 for The Office Bar and Club, 40 - 42 Windsor Road, Penarth.  The premises at 40 - 42 Windsor Road had been licensed as Penarth Royal Air Force Association Club.  The Club Premises Certificate was converted in 2005 from a Club Registration Certificate (under the 1964 Licensing Act). 


The hearing was informed that the Club Premises Certificate remained in place and authorised the supply of alcohol and the provision of regulated entertainment from 11:00 to 00:00 midnight Monday to Saturday and 12:00 noon to 22:30 on Sunday.


Mr. Warren and Mr. Arif had made an application for a Premises Licence to enable them to run a club on a commercial basis.  The application requested the following 


Regulated Entertainment -


Plays, Films and Indoor Sporting Events -

11:00 to 00:00 Midnight - seven days a week


Live Music –

11:00 to 00:00 Midnight - Monday to Friday

11:00 to 01:00 - Saturday;

12:00 Noon to 00:00 Midnight – Sunday


Recorded music and Performance of Dance –

11:00 to 00:00 Midnight - Monday to Thursday

11:0 to 01:00 - Friday and Saturday

12:00 Noon to 00:00 Midnight - Sunday


Sale of Alcohol –

11:00 to 00:00 Midnight - Monday to Thursday

11:00 to 01:00 - Friday and Saturday

12:00 Noon to 00:00 Midnight - Sunday


A copy of the full application was attached to the report at Appendix A.


During the 28 day consultation period representations had been received from South Wales Police, Trading Standards and Environmental Health and these representations were attached to the report at Appendices B, C and D.  On 23rd April, 2014 a representation was received from Penarth Town Council, a copy of this letter was attached to the report at Appendix E.  In addition, two representations were also received from local residents, a copy of these representations were attached to the report at Appendix F.


Following the presentation from the Licensing Officer, the Applicant, Mr. Warren, was invited to present his case and informed the hearing that he would be happy to change the hours of operation as advised by South Wales Police and Environmental Health.  The Legal Officer present asked for clarification on this point from the Applicant and whether they were now applying for a Premises Licence in line with the existing Club Premises Certificate.  Mr. Warren confirmed that this was the case and that it was an amended application. South Wales Police informed the hearing that they had negotiated with the Applicant and the Environmental Health Officer as they had concerns with regard to the hours and licensed activities applied for. 


South Wales Police presented their representations which advised reduced times for regulated entertainment, supply of alcohol and closing.  In addition they advised CCTV should be in operation at all times to cover the beer garden, all exits and entrances and to be installed within three months if the licence was granted.  Furthermore, it was advised that no off sales of alcohol should be made and the premises should operate a Challenge 21 Scheme.  The Applicant stated that they would agree to these conditions.


Mrs Jenkins, an Interested Party, advised that they had been in contact with the police with regards to the premises on several occasions and wanted to know what the police would be doing to protect against anti-social behaviour and was informed by South Wales Police that if any of the four Licensing Objectives were to be undermined by the activities at the premises it was possible to approach the Police and Responsible Authorities in order to ask for a review of the licence.  South Wales Police advised that they were unaware of the 101 calls made by Mrs. Jenkins but would chase this up and confirmed that they were aware of two calls relating to this premises.  On further questioning from a Member, South Wales Police informed the hearing that these calls pertained to an individual being ejected from the premises and another incident of anti-social behaviour outside the premises.  Mrs. Jenkins made further reference to calls made to the police about this premises on a regular basis and stated that these had been referred to within the correspondence which was contained within Appendix F attached to the report.  The Applicant stated they had no questions for South Wales Police.


The Trading Standards Officer presented the representations from Trading Standards which promoted the four Licensing Objectives and mirrored the representations made by South Wales Police with regard to CCTV, that is, a new CCTV system should be installed within three months, if the Licence was granted.  Furthermore, they advised that an authorisation of sales, signed and dated by the DPS should be kept at the premises showing all persons authorised by them to make sales of alcohol at the premises and a Refusals Register should also be maintained.  All staff should receive training in making responsible sales of alcohol before being permitted to make sales of alcohol to the public and training should be made available to the authorities on request with refresher training taking place at six monthly intervals, which would be documented and made available to the authorities on request.  In addition, it was advised that a Challenge 25 Scheme should be implemented at the premises at all times and only certain photo IDs such as passports should be accepted as identification with training to be provided to staff on how to spot fake identification.  The Applicant stated that they would be happy to accept these conditions. 


The Chairman asked the representative from Trading Standards whether they knew of any specific incidents in relation to this premises and was advised that there were none that they were aware of.  Mr. Owen, an Interested Party, asked if Trading Standards was advised that the CCTV should cover the beer garden and was informed by Trading Standards that all areas that the public have access to should be covered by CCTV.


The Environmental Health Officer presented the representations from Environmental Health and confirmed they had met with the Applicant with regard to their application.  They advised the same hours for Regulated Entertainment, supply of alcohol and closing times as South Wales Police for both non-standard and standard timings.  They raised concerns about Regulated Entertainment, particularly on Fridays and Saturdays until 1am and in the outdoor areas and therefore advised no Regulated Entertainment to take place to the exterior areas of the premises during standard and non-standard timings.  They expressed concern about the open ended nature of the application with regards to private parties, special events and sporting events in that it was too broad and advised that Temporary Event Notices (TENs) should be used to accommodate licensing events outside of the Premises Licence if granted as Environmental Health and South Wales Police are involved in the process for the award of TENs. 


The Environmental Health Officer also advised that the current Club Premises Licence had restrictive conditions and, if granted, the Premises Licence should be conditioned with eight conditions relating to the following issues 

  • Children on the Premises
  • Bottles and Glasses
  • Electrical Safety
  • Heating and Ventilation
  • Noise and Vibration
  • The Beer Garden


The full details of these conditions were contained within the representations from Environmental Health as attached to the report at Appendix D. 


Mr. Owen stated that he agreed with these representations, however, he just assurance that they would be enforced as it was a very quiet residential area.  Mrs. Jenkins asked whether noise insulation was a possibility for the premises as when music was being played, particularly live music, it could be very noisy.  Environmental Health advised that this type of work was very expensive, could be problematic particularly with old buildings and they would be more likely to recommend a reduction in operating hours rather than the installation of noise insulation.  Furthermore they were unaware of any Committee that had enforced this type of work without a notice or substantial complaints.


Mrs. Jenkins presented her representations to the hearing stating that they had been a neighbour of the club for approximately 10 years and previously the clientele consisted mainly of ex-service personnel with the beer garden rarely being used with no live music.  The clientele had changed, with noise disturbance particularly in the summer months which involved the clientele drinking early in the day with anti-social behaviour including swearing and an incident that involved an air rifle being shot.  Mrs. Jenkins stated that she had made several complaints which had been to limited avail and membership had not been withdrawn from individuals displaying anti-social behaviour.  She also expressed concern that the staff, one of which was the current Applicant, Mr. Warren, had not proactively managed the anti-social behaviour displayed by some of the clientele and therefore had concerns about him becoming the Licensee particularly without the involvement of the RAF Association.  She expressed a preference for the licence not to be granted and stated that it was vague in many areas, however, if it were to be granted, she requested that the Sub-Committee consider the neighbours in relation to Regulated Entertainment, sound insulation and CCTV.


Mr. Owen stated that his main concern was the beer garden as he had a young family and they spent a lot of time in their garden when the weather was fine.  However, they were unable to enjoy this when the beer garden was full of noisy clientele.  He made a request to play an audio recording that he had taped on the last Bank Holiday.  Following legal advice the Chairman informed the hearing that in the interest of fairness and natural justice that the recording could not be played as it would not provide the hearing with a balanced view as the Applicant had not been aware of this prior to the meeting and therefore was unable to be afforded the same opportunity and the Applicant objected to the tape being played. Mr. Owen went on to inform the hearing that on that day only birdsong could be heard, the area was residential and very quiet and he did not want that to be ruined.  Following these representations the Chairman asked whether they had any questions for the Interested Parties and Mr. Warren stated he had no questions. 


In summing up the Applicant stated that he had taken advice from Environmental Health and South Wales Police and was prepared to operate under instruction from them and had also contacted a company with regard to the CCTV system.  He also informed the hearing that he would do his best to allay the fears of local residents with regards to anti-social behaviour and had previously put signs in the beer garden with regard to the use of bad language. 


The Legal Officer asked the Applicant whether they would be running the Club Premises Certificate alongside a General Premises Licence and the Licensing Officer advised that the premises would no longer function as a membership club but would function as a commercial club.  South Wales Police stated that it would not be run under a Club Premises Certificate but Premises Licence.  The Legal Officer stated that clarification was required with regards to this, as did Mrs. Jenkins; they were two different licences, one a Club Premises Certificate which allowed the premises to be run as a members club whereas a General Premises Licence would allow all members of the public to patronise the premises.  Mrs. Jenkins stated that she was unaware of this and, in light of this, wanted the application to be rejected as the premises would be a pub rather than a Members’ Club, which in her opinion would be worse.  At this point, Mr. Warren stated that part of the conditions of the premises rental agreement was that they had to run the premises as club but that it would be run as a club with members rather than a membership club.  The Legal Officer informed the hearing that the Sub-Committee would not be able to take into account how the Premises Licence would be operated. 


Following this the Chairman asked the Sub-Committee if they had any questions.  A Member asked the Applicant whether any disciplinary action had been taken against the member who had been ejected from the club and was informed that they were unaware of this incident; South Wales Police advised that they were aware of this incident which occurred approximately one year ago.  Mr. Thomas, a witness for the Applicant, was afforded the opportunity to speak on this point by the Chairman, stated that it was an unfortunate incident and that this individual had not been a member of the RAFA Club and had been asked to leave after displaying threatening behaviour to staff and subsequently the Police had been called.  A Member also queried whether drinks were allowed to be taken outside the premises in glass or plastic containers and was informed by Mr. Warren, that drinks were permitted to be taken to the rear garden only but not to the front of the premises.  The Member expressed concern with regards to glasses being taken outside the premises and also queried whether a member could take a non-member into the club and in response was informed by the Chairman that this was not an issue for this Committee. 


There being no further questions, the Sub-Committee Members then retired to consider the application in private.


On return the Chairman informed the hearing that having considered the application and representations by the Police, Environmental Health Department, Trading Standards and Interested Parties and have considered the DCMS Guidance, the objectives of the Licensing Act 2003 and the Council’s Statement of the Licensing Policy, the Sub-Committee


RESOLVED - T H A T the application be granted as per the Applicants current Club Premises Certificate hours and subject to the following conditions:


Bottles and Glasses


Customers shall not remove bottles and glasses from the premises.


Beer Garden


The Beer Garden shall be closed and vacated by 22.00 hours.


The conditions set out in the Applicant’s Operating Schedule.


Mandatory Conditions


No supply of alcohol is to be made under the Premises Licence:


(a)       At a time where there is no designated premises supervisor in respect of the Premises Licence or


(b)       When the designated premises supervisor does not hold a personal licence or his personal licence is suspended.


Every supply of alcohol under the Premises Licence is to be made or authorised by a person who holds a personal licence.


Reason for decisions


As discussed at the Sub-Committee hearing with all parties the club premises hours were accepted.


The Sub-Committee did not impose any additional conditions in relation to the CCTV requirements other than those set out in the Applicant’s operating schedule.


The Sub-Committee reminded all concerned that issues in relation to noise nuisance should be report to the Environmental Health Department and/or the Police.  Issues in relation to crime and disorder should be reported to the Police and the Licensing Authority.


The Chairman advised that the Licensing Authority had the power to review this licence and any concerns in relation to its operation should be brought to the Authority’s attention as a when such concerns arose.